a. Using at least one specific example, how was “sin” treated within this film? Was it glamorized/glorified, or did it receive more of a biblical treatment (redemption, justice, mercy, grace, forgiveness, reconciliation, resolution, etc. etc.) Try to use different examples than the ones mentioned in previous posts. Feel free to disagree with other peoples’ ideas.
b. God says we should put nothing “worthless” in front of our eyes. What is good, excellent, redemptive about this film? What was worthwhile? Was anything worthless about it? Can you wholeheartedly recommend this film? To anyone? A pastor? A friend? A sibling? Teacher? Why? Why not? Who would this film NOT be appropriate for and why? Biblically explain and draw your conclusions.
b. God says we should put nothing “worthless” in front of our eyes. What is good, excellent, redemptive about this film? What was worthwhile? Was anything worthless about it? Can you wholeheartedly recommend this film? To anyone? A pastor? A friend? A sibling? Teacher? Why? Why not? Who would this film NOT be appropriate for and why? Biblically explain and draw your conclusions.
In the very beginning of the movie, idolotary is introduced...there is one scene where Marcus is praying to a small statue of an eagle. You see a lot of sin in this movie (Murder, lying, Mockery), but to me Idolotary was one of the only sins that was actually glorified.
ReplyDelete"The Eagle", which is the title of the movie (obviously), is referring to an idol that Marcus' dad once had and he goes on a search to find that idol. Near the end they prepare to "protect the eagle" as if it is some god. But it's not!
This movie was not worthless. It was suspenful enough to keep me interested. I don't know if it's just me, but when something tragic in a movie happens, like someone dying or betrayal, it makes me want to keep watching to see if the problem is resolved. And in this case, thats exactly what happened.
I don't know if I would recommend this movie. Though it is FANTASTIC and intense, it definetly wasn't glorifying God. I don't know if I could watch this movie if God was sitting right next to me watching it with me...
The major sin I saw in The Eagle was idolatry. The whole movie was based on Marcus going on a quest for a piece of metal... really? He put not only his life, but also Esca's. When someone cares enough about some material possession so passionately, I think that means it has become an idol. In Exodus 20:23 God says "Do not make any gods to be alongside me; do not make for yourselves gods of silver or gods of gold." The Eagle (made of gold) is treated as a form and symbol of the power of Rome and the 9th Cohort. This was the major sin I saw, and was astounded by how the movie glorified a piece of metal.
ReplyDeleteI agree, I think the main sin in this movie was idolatry. This sin was definitely glorified. The whole movie is about Marcus trying to find a piece of gold. Throughout the movie multiple people were praying to something besides God. I didn’t think that this movie was worthless, I actually kind of liked it. I’m not usually the type of person to like war movies, but I thought The Eagle was pretty good. If God was sitting right by me when I watched this movie I would most likely pick a different movie that glorifies Him, and not an eagle made out of gold.
ReplyDeleteOne of the concepts of the film that stood out to me in a good way was the friendship between Marcus and Esca. No, it was not a good thing that Esca betrayed Marcus, but there was one scene in particular that proved true loyalty.
ReplyDeleteIn the scene, Marcus’ weakened body cannot take another moment of the exhausting journey back home. He stops Esca and tells him to take the Eagle and leave Marcus to die. Esca refused, for he had made an oath to Marcus. The only way Esca would leave is if he would free him; Marcus then freed him from slavery, and Esca was on his way. Later, Esca returns with soldiers to defeat the English tribe.
I suppose the film was worthwhile, for it did have some moral concepts (and I have an interest in action movies). However, I could not whole-heartedly recommend this film due to the sins it glorified: murder, slavery, and idolatry.
Psalm 101:3 (ESV) says, “I will not set before my eyes anything that is worthless. I hate the work of those who fall away; it shall not cling to me.” Even God tells us to not to put anything worthless in front of us, because we can easily become influenced by it.
Is Marcus really an idolater or is he trying to seek out the truth of what happened to his father and his legion? Isn't seeking out the truth a good thing?
ReplyDeleteI know if my Dad went missing I would go looking for him and I would also try to restore honor to my family. Is Marcus really sinful in his behavior or am I missing the point?
I agree that the main sin of the movie was idolatry, but because of the image that was put across for the Eagle. The Romans treasured that piece of gold shaped as an eagle, so much so that Marcus's family was dishonored because his father lost it.
ReplyDeleteOne of the definitions of the word "idol" from dictionary.com is this: "any person or thing regarded with blind admiration, adoration, or devotion." No one in the movie physically bowed down to the eagle. But Marcus's obsession for the eagle became his idol for that period of time when he was searching for it.
We all do this in real life. We obsess over looks, grades, famous people, sports, etc. This is the same thing that Marcus did in the movie. Is this considered idolatry? If so, that means that we are idolaters too, right?
I agree so much with Lucy. I really liked how she worded and explained the third paragraph. I also agree that the movie is not worthless, because it shows a lot about friendship and what it means to be a good friend to someone.
ReplyDeleteOn the other hand, Izzy, I'm just interested, but how did Esca betray Marcus? But, I do think Psalm 101:3 was a great verse to put for that question.
I agree with Mr. Scott. Yes he does worship an Eagle, but i think we can all admit that we idolize things now. I am not saying it is ok that he did that, and we did that either. Was the movie really about finding the Eagle or was it about finding the truth, and seeking the truth. So yes, I agree with Nathan that it was weird that he was risking his life to find a piece of metal, but I think it is why he was searching for it that was the point. Marcus was searching for the Eagle for the truth! Which I don't think it's wrong to want to know the truth. God actually wants us to seek the truth.
ReplyDeleteI also bring to the table the point of the attractiveness of the mail leads. Maybe it is just me, or if a very cute guy is committing a sin, it kind of makes it more tempting. Was that the goal of the people who made this film? I have no clue, but it is just something to think about. Also I think it could bring about a little lust for some people.
I think there was justice and mercy and grace in this movie as well. To me murdering people for fun is a sin, but when Marcus saved Esca's life he showed him mercy. The people were also humbled in the end when they realized that they were falsely gossiping about Marcus's family.
I don't think it is a worthless film. It taught good lessons, and I think as believers we don't need to worry about being tempted to worship an eagle. We do mess up and Idolize, but we have forgiveness. I think we need to focus more on the message and the ideas of friendship and brotherly love in the movie.
Maggi's got a good point, he did look for the metal to find truth...but he also did it for the glory of himself/to bring honor to his family. But like Mr. Scott said, bringing honor to your family is not necissarily a bad thing, I think. I think it comes down to the way you use that honor, like taking advantage of it and stuff. For me honor is like respect. If you honor someone, you probably respect them. We all want people to respect us, or at least I do in some cases. But to take advantage of that by putting yourself in a higher place is sin. That's called pride. So did he want honor for his family for himself? Or to restore his family's name?.....
ReplyDeleteI agree with all of you. Marcus is trying to find the eagle which is not a bad thing. I understand if he feels the need to find it to bring honor to his family, but I find it a bit self- centered and obsessive. The main focal point of the movie is Marcus fighting for his life to find this one piece of metal. He is obviously not a christian because like Lucy said there was a scene of him praying to the eagle. Honestly I don't think the film glorified idolatry though. I would recommend this movie for its high intensity level and great action, although i would not recommend it for the language use and many sins( idolatry, murder, violence)
ReplyDeleteI also agree with everything that you guys said. Idolatry is the main focus of the sin in this movie. But, I also think that it was needed so that you could tell that he was a Roman and not a Christian. All he tried to do was bring honor back to his family for what his father did. His father and all 5000 men died during the raid but, no one knew what actually happened. The scene with him praying to the eagle was abviously idolatry. He thought that a piece of metal could help him. This movie was good for its action and intensity level. There was bad language and many sins though.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Mr. Scott. I don't think Marcus was completely idolizing the eagle. I believe he was trying to find out the truth about his father and restore his family's name. He didn't go on the quest just to find the eagle, he went on it mainly to find out about his father and show honor to his family and country. This wasn't the wrong thing to do.
ReplyDeletei disagree,i do not think that marcus was worshiping the eagle. I think that he was trying to restore honor to his family and to his father especially. I still believe that the theme of this movie was idolatry just not towards the eagle. Throughout the movie people are praying to multiple gods not only the God.
ReplyDeleteLying, that is what Esca had to do to keep him and Marcus alive. The leader of the tribe hated the Romans, so if Marcus had not been the slave both of them would have died. Many people have different views on lying. I personally think that the only time you can lie is if it betters God's kingdom. In the movie they make a big deal of promises. In the beginning, when Esca is made to be Marcus's slave, he gives Marcus his knife as a symbol of a promise to never leave his side. In the end, the sin was justified as bad. When Esca lied the relationship between Marcus and Esca became hurt and broken, but in the end they trusted each other with their lives. A lie can break a friendship quickly, but trust takes a long time to gain.
ReplyDeleteI'm going to have to disagree with the idea that Marcus went to look for his dad. He had already known his dad was missing, and if he really wanted to look for his dad, he would've been long gone already. He only got the idea to go on the quest when he heard The Eagle had been spotted. It was the lust to return the honor of the 9th Cohort and to get glory from retrieving The Eagle. Also, another sin in this movie and an obvious one at that is murder. The Romans and natives alike murder each other. I could not suggest this movie to someone without saying something about all the killing. I have seen movies worse in this sin, but it is still a terrible thing when you really realize how all the important lives that God all made, are just taken and forgotten.
ReplyDeleteHannah, when I said that Esca betrayed Marcus, I was referring to when Esca traveled all around the country when he knew where the Eagle was the whole time. Second, when they stayed with the tribe, Esca was going to let the leader kill Marcus. Finally, Esca told the tribe leader that Marcus was his slave. I believe that he said that to protect him and Marcus, but the part that I believe is betrayal was how Esca let the people treat Marcus so poorly.
ReplyDeleteI totally agree with Maggie with the lust telling us that these sins are okay. We need to remember that God looks at the heart, not the outside. We need to do the same too. So instead of thinking about the good looks of the character, decide if his/her actions live up to God’s potential.
I sort of disagree, I don't think Esca was doing all of that to protect Marcus, Esca would have stopped the leader from killing Marcus if he really wanted to protect him. I also don't think he Esca would have told the leader that Marcus was his slave if he actually wanted him safe. The ending scene, although changed my mind. Esca came back for Marcus; that part sort of confused me? If he wanted Marcus killed before, why is he coming back to save him?
ReplyDeleteA major sin in the movie was defiantly murder. There was lots of it in the movie. Some examples were in wars, the Seal people killing the young boy at the end of the movie, and the fighting ring. All though, they didn't actually kill anyone in it, that was the purpose for it. I think the movie did and did not glamorize murder. I think they did because, like mentioned before, the fighting ring was built so that two men could fight to the death in it for no reason at all. Esca was put in the ring to fight for his life when he had done nothing to be put in there. On the other hand, I don't think the movie glamorized it because they showed that after they did fight in a war it caused heartbreak for many characters.
ReplyDeleteI also agree with Nathan, I don't think Marcus went searching for his dad. He knew his father was dead. So why would he look for him. He wanted to find the eagle to bring glory to his family and himself.
ReplyDeleteI think pride is sin the movie because Marcus is trying to the eagle back and to gain back his family honor. What surprised me is that angry wasn't a sin. Both Marcus and Esca had a family member killed from the other side. Instead they were like brothers to each other.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Nathan, that idolatry was the main sin. Marcus risked his life, he risked Esca's life, and he risked the life's of the older Roman soldiers. Over what? a hunk of metal.
ReplyDeleteI agree that idolatry is in the movie a lot. As McKenna said before, they loved this eagle so much that they would shame the man who lost it and his family. They don't even know how it was lost, but they know that they want to blame someone.
ReplyDeleteIn the movie I saw a an example of idolatry in the beginning. I thought that it was horrible for Marcus to risk his life, and Esca's life. He also killed to get this little metal eagle.
ReplyDeleteAlso in this movie, I think the sin of idolatry and murder were glorified. Because in the movie I cant remember who it was, but everyone was making fun of him because he didn't kill a lot of people. When Marcus and his team killed the enemy it did look murder look like it was the right thing to do.
I agree with Nick, Idolatry was portrayed in the beginning and clearly thats a sin. In Deuteronomy 5:7 it says, " you shall have no gods before me." I don't think murder was glorified though. Sometimes it was, but the majority they just had to for self defense. I don't think that glorified it
ReplyDeleteI think that the movie focused to much on this statue instead of real glory! A statue was just another item for the main character to obsess about. They made it an idol for themselves when in truth, when it comes down to the line, it's just another piece of metal. It won't save them or protect them from destruction, it won't be there to heal their wounds, and it won't be there to answer their cries for help, but God can.
ReplyDeleteSofie is right, it didn't completely glorify murder, it was self defence. There was a lot of killing, and they also slit the one kids throat, which i think was completely unnecessary for the movie, it did not need that in there at all. But yes Nick, you're right about how in the beginning they had some ideas of Idolatry.
ReplyDeleteI agree with S. Harjoe I don't think murder was glorified at all. It was necessary to the story but it wasn't glorified at all.
ReplyDeleteAn example of sin in this movie was when they would worship to the eagle and like do this whole thing like an assembly to pray and when something good happens they worship the eagle and thank him. There wasn't that much grace, mercy, and forgiveness but there was lots of justice. so i would have to say that this didn't worship the biblical culture i would say.
ReplyDeleteThe things in the movie were worth doing for instance Marcus helped Esca by saving his life. Another is Esca runs to the fastest of his abilities to get help for Marcus. Somethings were not worth there time for killing people. I would recommend this film to everyone because you would be able to see the good and the bad from not just the christian point of view but everyones point of view. I don't think this film is bad i think its good and that anyone should watch it.
I agree with Nick that murder wasn't glorified at all. Murder was necessary because this movie was about war. This movie had lots of death and murder in it because it was key to telling this story more throughly. The Bible says that one of the commandments is do not murder. When the chiefs son slit his son's throat that was not necessary. He might have thought that is was necessary to slit his child's throat in order to prove a point to Marcus and Esca. But, he still should not have slit his throat. When you are fighting for your country and not yourself killing is okay but, when you kill somebody for no reason that's just plain wrong. Esca and Marcus may have killed a lot of the barbarian tribe members but, that was necessary to save their skins.
ReplyDeleteI think that the main sin in this movie is idolatry. I do believe that Marcus was trying to find out the truth about his father but he also prayed to the eagle to help him find out the truth and restore his families honor which is idolatry. Also lying was glorified in this movie because when Esca said that Marcus was his slave it crushed Marcus but it was honored because he only said that lie to protect the both of them. Because of the murder scenes and the worshipping of the eagle i would probably not suggest this movie to any younger people and it would show them Idolatry and mockery and lying and those are bad things. God doesn't want us to watch something worthless but i agree that this movie showed some important life lessons.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Miles that murder wasn’t glorified. Without it the movie wouldn’t have made sense and been good at all. I know it’s a sin but is it really bad if you are defending your country and trying to get what is rightfully yours?
ReplyDeleteI love what Julia said about idolatry being one of the main sins of the movie, and that how when Esaca's lie was honored because he lied for a good reason. I disagree though on idolatry being the only main sin in this movie. In this movie I felt it circled a lot around murder. In the beginning when the romans went into battle it seemed like it was awesome brave thing to go kill people. The movie really pictured murder as a thing that was necessary to do, to get what you want. Marcus killed to get the eagle, to restore his honor
ReplyDeleteI agree and disagree with Casey about how if you are murdering someone to protect yourself and your country while trying to get something that's rightfully yours that it wouldn't actually be bad. I agree because you are protecting your selves and your natural rights because we all deserve to live but I disagree because murder is still against the law and even if you are using it for self defense like sofie said, it would still be counted as murder and as a sin.
ReplyDeleteIn the 10 Commandments it says "you shall not murder." Not something like "you shall not murder but it's okay if its for self defense." Julia is right, it is still a sin and it is still bad.
ReplyDeleteI agree with all of you when you say that murder isn't being glorified. I think in the movie it is saying how cruel murder is and that it was really rough for them. When you see Esca's people slit that little boy's throat you can see the pain on everyone's face.
ReplyDeleteAlso, Ben is right. But I have a question. Do you think that what America is doing (fight over in Afghanistan) is right? Or are we sinning? Because technically, that is self defense. We're not killing them just to kill them. We obviously have a reason. So is that wrong?
Exodus 22:2 says: “If a thief is caught breaking in at night and is struck a fatal blow, the defender is not guilty of bloodshed"...in Exodus 22 they are stating the "Protection of Property" As the title of the chapter.
I also found this bible study thing and it says: "Also, remember that on the very day of his arrest Christ said to his disciples, “If you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one” (Luke 22:36). Christ expected things to become very unsafe for his disciples after his death, and told them to prepare to defend themselves from unjust aggression." (http://www.truthortradition.com/iphone/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=123:what-does-the-bible-say-about-killing-in-self-defense&catid=36:faqs&Itemid=59)
Something that I saw that was good and excellent about this film was how was friendship was displayed. It almost reminded me of the friendship between David and Jonathan. The big sin that I saw was idolatry bcause, yes Marcus was trying to protect his family and prove that he could do it, but it seemed as though he got too caught up in getting the eagle. It was as though he was worshiping it and not just doing what he was saying he was. Also they made it seem like it was a good thing, to worship the eagle. People called each other cowards because they ran from protecting the eagle, which I think is wrong. They also risked their lives just to keep it and to say that they had it.
ReplyDeletelucy, I really liked the question you asked, and I have no idea what the answer is. I guess I can try to guess. In the bible there were plenty of wars , and God helped the Israelites. I also really like the things you posted about the Bible study. Because there is sin in the world, people do fight and try to harm each other. Personally I think this is a hard subject to touch on.
ReplyDeleteI think one of the only sins really glorified in this movie was pride. In the held Esca gives the senator's son a little "look" at the end of the movie. You could tell he was trying to stick it to him, He was prideful, and they made it look cool. It was like he was saying I win you loose. The Bible does not want us to be sore winners.“Let not the wise boast of their wisdom or the strong boast of their strength or the rich boast of their riches,"(Jeremiah 9:23) The Lord is talking and He says this followed by Him saying that we should boast in the Lord. It means don't brag about yourself, our how strong, or smart you are, or how much money you have. In the verses following it says that God does not like those things. When the good guy boasts it can look good, but we are not to fall into that temptation.
Dishonesty is one of the sins I will talk about.
ReplyDelete"Honesty guides good people; dishonesty destroys treacherous people"
Esca coould have been destroyed by dishonesty.
Marcus could have killed Esca when he lied about where he was from and what he knew about the battle Marcus' Father died in.
Lying was glorified many people in this movie many times. Marcus and Esca lie to almost everyone across the wall.
ReplyDeleteEsca lied to Marcus. Esca lied to the people of the painted faces about Marcus being a slave.
The man Marcus killed to get the eagle lied and said that his dad pleaded for mercy and was a wimp
i agree with Alex about the dishonestly. There was a lot of dishonestly with both Marcus and Esca. They encouraged it and made it sound like its okay to lie, when we all know its not. Since they both lied they ended up getting the eagle and winning the wars. So they sinned and still ended up winning and getting everything they wanted.
ReplyDeleteYes, Marcus and Esca lied to each other throughout the movie. At first they lied to each other because they had not established a relationship yet, but as the movie progressed, they became more confident with each other and even risked their live to save the other. So yes they did lie, but I do not think the movie encourages it. When Esca lied to the chief about Marcus being his slave, I think Esca did that only to save him. As I have said before, I think that lying is fine if it betters God's kingdom.
ReplyDeleteWe have been talking about all of the bad things to do with the movie, so I and going to say some good things about it. Some good ideas I saw was the idea of loyalty and helping others in need. Loyalty was a huge issue. Esca stayed loyal to Marcus even though it appeared that he was betraying Marcus. Since Esca still was loyal to Marcus, they retrieved the eagle and escaped.
ReplyDeleteHelping others was another good thing I saw. An example is when Marcus saved Esca's life when he was fighting the gladiator. Marcus could have gone with the crowd and let Esca die, but he chose what was right and convinced the people to let him live.
I agree. I feel like everyone ( including me) is almost trash talking the movie. I think that everyone is bringing up some good points about themes and such but nobody has really said anything positive. I think a good theme from this movie is that perseverance is rewarded. In the movie its not just about retrieving a stupid animal figurine, it went a lot deeper. The movie really gave insight to Roman culture and the meaning of gaining and restoring honor.
ReplyDeletethe scene with Esca and the gladiator i think has a sinful idea because it is killing weaker people for their own entertainment. no, it was not handeled in a Biblical way, it is meant to serve justice but it is doing it the wrong way, they believe justice is the slave gets beat up by the "hero" the gladiator. in all fairness the slave might be more of a follower of God than the "hero".
ReplyDeleteno, i would not recomend this to anyone, including young children who wouldn't understand the questions we are asking ourselves. i do think it is a good movie to watch if you think it through like we did and apply verses and different views.
I love what Mckenna said about loyalty and helping others. Although Esca and Marcus's friendship wasn't the greatest at times Esca was still loyal and trustworthy to Marcus and that showed Loyalty. I do believe that they helped each other and that Esca was always there for Marcus even when it looked like he was betraying him instead.
ReplyDeleteAlong with what I said earlier about it is a good movie to watch if we apply verses and different views. saying that I dont think this is worthless to put in front of us. instead I think it is good to see wrong from right, and good verses bad.
ReplyDeletePsalm 101:3 (ESV) says, “I will not set before my eyes anything that is worthless. I hate the work of those who fall away; it shall not cling to me.” i feel this is a good verse for the whole movie. first because there was alot of sin. one sin is that there was alot of killing and it made the killing look good because if you killed the most people you won. another sin is that people were judging everyone by their appearence. One last sin is that people would look down on people. for example alot of people had slaves that they would boss around and tell them what to do.
ReplyDeleteI see what you're saying Logan, but killing in battle isn't always bad. There are many instances in the Bible when God tells his people to go into to battle and to destroy the entire population.
ReplyDeleteMason I agree with what you said on lying and I think you showed a great example of it.
ReplyDeleteI would recommend this movie to anybody it was a great movie. I don't know if I can really pick up on what was redemptive of this film. But anyway I think that this was a great movie.
I realized that Esca is a big encouragement to Marcus....when I thought this Proverbs 27:17 came to my mind, "As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another." I think that if Esca was not with Marcus on the journey Marcus wouldn't have been able to finish.
ReplyDeleteI really felt like the Esca's lie was a great example about something can be wrong but in the end it was the right thing to do. telling lies definitely wrong but in Esca situation it saved Marcus's life. So I don't think telling that lie was a bad thing to do.
ReplyDeleteEveryone is saying that the sin wasn't treated biblically, when I saw one way that sin was, and that was through forgiveness. Esca betrayed Marcus and told the tribe people that he was his slave, but Marcus didn't know that Esca was doing this to protect him. In the end Marcus discovered why Esca was really treating him like that, and Esca was forgiven. Marcus didn't treat Esca disrespectfully; he forgave him because Esca saved his life. I don't believe this film was worthless, like several people said. I think that it taught me a lot about friendship, honor, trust, and forgiveness. I would recommend this film to people who want to learn more about this, but it was very brutal. If violence and blood gets to you, then I would recommend passing.
ReplyDelete