Wednesday, October 19, 2011
Question #2: Themes
Give a major theme/idea/message of the film. Discuss what you think the film’s point was (in relation to this theme) – and then comment on whether or not you think Scripture agrees with the way the theme was presented. Employ at least 1 Bible verse to make your point. Remember to use the Scripture in context. Again, feel free to comment on and disagree with other peoples’ ideas; and if you see someone else use Scripture that you think is out of context, please look it up and report back on your findings. Feel free to explore other themes than the ones mentioned already.
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I felt that the main theme of this movie was, “Do everything for your honor.” In the film, Marcus’ father was dishonored for losing the Eagle. The Eagle was a symbol of respect, which belonged to the Roman people.
ReplyDeleteMarcus got so sick of his family’s name being the butt of every joke that he wanted to honor his family by returning the sacred Eagle. He did everything he could within his power to get it. With that being said, he risks his and Esca’s life to obtain the emblem. In the end, the Eagle is returned to the Romans, and Marcus’ name is once again honored.
I believe that Scripture does not agree with the theme of the movie. Yes, the Bible does say that you are supposed to do everything to honor God, but the movie portrayed it along the lines of doing everything to honor yourself (or family).
Colossians 3:23 says, “Whatever you do, work at it with all your heart, as working for the Lord, not for men.” 1 Corinthians 10:31 says, “So, whether you eat or drink, or whatever you do, do all to the glory of God.” Both of these verses state that everything should be done to honor God.
I thought a major theme in this movie was friendship. In the beginning of the movie Marcus saves a slave’s life just because he doesn’t want to see him get killed. Throughout the movie, Marcus and the slave are loyal to each other, except when they are with the group of painted people. Even there the slave is just pretending. Proverbs 27:17 says, “As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.” I think this is saying that friends will make you a better person all around, which is exactly what happened to Marcus and his slave. In my opinion scripture definitely agrees with the theme of friendship in the movie The Eagle.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Casey when he said that the main theme was friendship. They remain friends through almost the whole movie except when the painted people showed up. Esca lied and deceived the painted people that he was on their side and that Marcus was his slave. The Bible says that the most important commandment is to love your neighbor as yourself. Scripture is in agreement with this movie. Marcus and his slave become great friends and watch over each other.
ReplyDeleteI also agree with Casey when he said the main theme was friendship. Throughout the whole movie they are taking risks for eachother.
ReplyDeleteAs miles said the bible says the most important commandment is to love your neighbor as yourself. One part of this movie that shows this is when marcus saves escas life by getting everyone in the stadium to agree with him.
I agree with all of the other themes, but I think another big one is "stand up for what you believe in". Marcus stood up for is family and for what he thought was right. Esca also lied to his own "people" to save his friend and at that time his "master."
ReplyDeleteI think it is, in a way, a biblical theme. God wants us to stand up for Him. Even when everyone else is mocking God's name or going against Him, He wants us to be different. Everyone has heard the story of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abendigo. Daniel 3:16-18 "Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego replied to him, “King Nebuchadnezzar, we do not need to defend ourselves before you in this matter.If we are thrown into the blazing furnace, the God we serve is able to deliver us from it, and he will deliver us[c] from Your Majesty’s hand. But even if he does not, we want you to know, Your Majesty, that we will not serve your gods or worship the image of gold you have set up.'" God wants us to love and praise him. Shadrach, Meshach, and Abendigo were willing to give up their lives for God.
I agree with Casey; I think one of the main themes was friendship. marcus and Esca, I think, showed signs of being good friends throughout the whole movie. For example, when they run into the Seal people Esca was just trying to protect Marcus from being killed by them. Casey and Miles, I can see where you would think that Esca was in the wrong, but I believe he only did it to protect his friend. I also agree with Casey's bible verse, Proverbs 27:17, I think it is the best fit for what the question is asking.
ReplyDeleteIzzy, I agree with everything that you said. I liked how you explained everything and the two bible verses you picked out for explaining were very good.
ReplyDeleteI think that another theme in this movie is honor is makes you someone. Marcus tries so hard and even risks his life to regain the honor of his family. Nothing is wrong with trying to have honor, but we have to remember that we live in God. Our self worth is not judged by what others think, but by Jesus Christ. 2Corinthians 12:19 Have you been thinking all along that we have been defending ourselves to you? We do not find our self worth in other people, only in Christ do we find what we are looking for.
ReplyDeleteI agree with what Maggie theme and the verse she picked because when Esca was doing the gladiator fight, he didn't fight because he was standing up for what he believed in even if he was going to die.
ReplyDeleteI completely agree with Casey, Logan and Maggie. They all said that the main theme was friendship, which I think is definitely true. From when Marcus yelled life at the competition, it started a friendship. They each carried out in they're part with, looking out for each other and respecting the other person in what they believe in. I think John 15:13 is a great example of the friendship between Marcus and Esca. Both men were willing to die for each other, which shows true friendship
ReplyDeleteI agree with Casey. Esca was willing to lie to a evil Indian tribe that would kill him if he messed up or if they were upset with him. Marcus at the end of the movie could have made Esca stay with him and possibly have them die together, so he gives Esca his freedom because it is in Esca's best interest.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Casey and Izzy. I think that Friendship is a huge theme in this movie, because even when times got rough for Marcus and Esca they didn't stop trying together. And I definitely agree with Izzy and her theme. Because this whole movie was based off of what Marcus was doing to get the metal eagle back that his father had made. Marcus is also getting his family honor back this whole movie.
ReplyDeleteI think the Theme was You can do a lot with trust because Marcus was put through things because his slave that now was his master was lying to people. Marcus had to trust him because Esca was also the translater for him. I think that Scripture does agree with this because we are suppused to trust God and that he will get us threw anything. Deuteronomy 1:32 NIV "In spite of this, you did not trust in the Lord your God." I use this verse because it shows that God wants us to trust him and we cant to do anything without him.
ReplyDeleteI agree with both Casey and Izzy. I believe that Friendship is the lesser of the two. You can definitely see friendship as a theme but i don't thing it was the main theme. I agree with Izzy's theme much more because the whole movie was about restoring honor to Marcus and his family
ReplyDeleteFriendship is the main theme in this movie. But, restoring honor is also a big theme in this film. Marcus and Esca were friends through the whole movie even when Esca hit Marcus and told the chief's son to kill him if it pleases him. Esca saved Marcus and then helped him get his eagle back from the chief. When they fell asleep Esca woke Marcus up and they crossed the river to get the eagle. Before they got out the chief was there and the other tribe members showed up. Esca and Marcus both fought for each other and themselves. In the beginning Marcus was trying to get his honor back from when his father lost the eagle in the forbidden lands. He fought with honor when he fought the barbarian tribe when they attacked their fort. The Romans fought back the barbarians and killed the ones inside the fort.
ReplyDeleteI agree with nick although nick and izzy and mason. I think that friendship was a theme of the movie and so was trust but the biggest theme that i saw and agree with it honor. In the movie if you didn't have someones honor or trust you would never know if they were out to kill you or if they had your back. Also throughout the whole movie Marcus was trying to restore his fathers honor and prove to the people that he wasn't a coward that that he actually cared about the eagle and protecting it. Matthew 15:8-9 says, "These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men." This verse relates to honor in the movie because the men fighting with Marcus's father might have said that they all honored him but after the fight they couldn't believe that they actually did honor him. Also when some men from the camp were eating dinner and Marcus was speaking to the eagle, the men were saying that since his father lost his honor then maybe Marcus was trying to do the same and that they should just obey him for a short time and stop when Marcus does something wrong.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Hannah when she said that she thinks Esca was only treating Marcus bad to protect him. I think if he didn't do that they both could have been killed.
ReplyDeleteI totally agree with Julia, trust is one HUGE theme of this movie. If there was no trust in the movie, I don't think Marcus would've ever found the idol because he wouldn't have wanted to trust Esca, so he wouldn't have brought him. But trust could also be one of the conflicts. Marcus trusted Esca and Esca did betray him at one point. Even though it is good to trust people, I think it is crucial that you watch out, because everyone has sinned, and we all are tempted to go behind someones back, or leave them in the dust. The only person that we can actually trust is God. Throughout the Bible I couldn't find very many verses on trusting friends. I only found verses on trusting God. Now I know that as people of God we are supposed to be REAL friends. But everyone sins! It is impossible to have the perfect friendship with someone. The only verse I found in Psalms about trusting a friend is Psalm 41:8: "Even my close friend, someone I trusted, one who shared my bread, has turned against me."
ReplyDeleteLucy I like what you said, but i am not sure if Esca really betrayed Marcus. He pretended to be Marcus's master to save them both. Maybe he did have a little self satisfaction in treating Marcus that way, but he was doing what he thought was best. Though i think we really are trying to get in Esca's heart which we can't do, A. because it is a movie, and B. only God can see into peoples hearts. So i agree trust is a really big theme, which can also be related to life at westminster and as a Christian. We need to trust God. It sometimes may seem like God is betraying us, but he is carving our path and doing what is best for us. to be continued........
ReplyDeleteSomething that I found incredible was the fact that even though Marcus was the new "slave" of Esca he did not retaliate and fight back, when in truth that is amazing. If I had been put into the exact situation as Marcus I would have fought back but yet Marcus didn't. I think that is honor on behalf of Marcus that he didn't harm Esca.
ReplyDeleteLucy, I also see your point when you say that Esca betrayed Marcus, even though it was for both their own good in the long run, but I don't think it was complete betrayal. I personally think that it was great of Esca to do that, it saved their lives! Although, I also think the least he could've done was clue Marcus in on his scheme, it would have made the situation less tense and less confusing. If Esca had clued him on what he was doing their relationship with each other at the time would not have been at risk. But, I TOTALLY agree with you on the fact that it was, at least somewhat, betrayal.
Now that I think about it, Julia...You are right about trust being another huge theme in this movie. And I also agree with you Lucy when you said that Marcus wouldn't have gotten the eagle without the help of Esca.
ReplyDeleteNow I am continuing where I left off. As I was saying God has his own path for each of us. Romans 11:33-36 33 "Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable his judgments,
ReplyDeleteand his paths beyond tracing out! “Who has known the mind of the Lord? Or who has been his counselor?” “Who has ever given to God, that God should repay them? For from him and through him and for him are all things. To him be the glory forever! Amen." You all may know this as the Doxology, but I feel that so many people say it without understanding it. It says that only God knows everything, and we would be naive to think that we can control God. We should do everything through him. The line that really relates to the story is "How unsearchable his judgments, and his paths beyond tracing out!" We can not understand his judgements nor can we understand what Esca was really trying to do.
I agree, on top of all the other themes I think trust was the main theme. throughout the whole movie Marcus and Esca trusted eachother
ReplyDeleteI wasn't completely finished with my thought: Even though Esca did betray Marcus, it was kinda for their own good, so yes, I agree with you Maggi and Maddie. But the reason why I do think there was some REAL betrayal between them, is because in one scene, Esca told the man to kill Marcus. I think that is going a little too far, because what if he actually did? Then what?!?! Boom. End of movie.
ReplyDeleteAnd yes, I know that my last verse (Psalm 41:8) is kind of out of context, I was questioning myself on whether I should type it or not...because that was the only verse I found on trusting friends.
I love how Julia mentioned that another movie theme was trust. I never came to think of that myself. Going through that now, I realize the friendship between Marcus and Esca would not have been as strong.
ReplyDeleteEsca was very trusting, and loyal to Marcus. He showed this when he threw his dagger at the feet of Marcus. It showed that he could trust Esca. Marcus trusted Esca on the outing to find the eagle. Esca could have easily killed him the moment they were alone. Also, he trusted him when Esca said he would return for Marcus, and he did.
They always have each other’s back, especially when they are being invaded. I really want to challenge myself to become as good as a friend as they were with each other. John 15:13 says, “Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.” I believe that Esca and Marcus set a great example of this.
Do you think that a theme of the film has to do with the need for us to look at things from a different point of view?
ReplyDeleteEsca is constantly testing Marcus to look at things from another point of view.
For example:
Marcus has unquestioning loyalty to Rome, to the point of being blind to other things. Esca is quick to point out that Rome slaughtered his people.
Do you agree that it is a theme? If you do is it Biblical? Why or Why not?
I think that loyalty was another main theme of the movie. Although honor and friendship are defiantly good themes, I think that loyalty was sometimes overlooked. But what is loyalty? Loyalty is when you are faithful to something, like friends, leaders, etc. Esca was supposed to be Marcus's slave, but through their journey to retrieve the Eagle they became close friends. They both saved each other's lives and they sticked together through out most of the movie.
ReplyDeleteLoyalty is a huge part of having healthy friendships. If you are not loyal, then your friendship will fall apart. The best example of a loyal friendship is David and Jonathan in 1 Samuel. Jonathan was loyal to David even though his father was trying to kill David. Jonathan put his life in danger to be friends with David.
In regards to Mr.Scotts question i think there is different point of views because we see it from Esca and Marcus's point of view. I disagree with you Mr.Scott when you say that the theme has to do with where Marcus and Esca came from and how they are very qiuck to say there from Rome or watever. I think the theme is more of a trust theme.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Mckenna. I also believe that loyalty was a major theme of the movie because like Mckenna said loyalty is when someone is faithful to something or someone else. In the movie Esca and Marcus are loyal to each other by sticking by each others side and trusting each other. When Esca lied to the tribe he was still being a loyal friend to Marcus even though it didn't look that way at first. Loyalty is trusting each other and being there for one another and Marcus and Esca really showed that towards one another during the movie.
ReplyDeleteI along with others think a main theme is trust. Mostly because Marcus completely trusted Esca with his life. Esca could have easily left and been free and not come back for Marcus. A Bible verse I found on this is Micah 7:5 "Do not trust a neighbor ; put no confidence in a friend." this verse sort of surprised me when I read it, but I think it applies because Marcus should have been putting his trust in God the whole time. Instead he trusted a false idol(the eagle).
ReplyDeleteI think the theme of this movie was "If you go after what you want, you can get it." Marcus goes after The Eagle even though everyone says it is impossible. But the truth is that you can only truly accomplish what you especially want through the help of God. Philippians 4:13 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." It is through God who we should look to, to complete our tasks, not ourselves.
ReplyDeleteOne more comment about this question is how much we could see a theme being good vs. evil, but there was no good or bad guys. The movie makes the painted people look like the enemies, but what if the movie was from their point of view? The tribe beats their oppressors and takes the Rome’s Eagle. Then the Eagle gets stolen and the men get murdered by the Romans. It would've made Marcus look like a bad guy. So, I think we should be a little more discerning on how we judge good people and bad people.
ReplyDeleteI've heard this saying a lot, and sometimes my dad has even said it to me. "Even when you fail, try try again." I'm not positive that those are the exact words but it's something close. In this movie, Marcus NEVER gives up on anything, not even Esca. No matter what he keeps trying and trying and he eventually finds what he's looking for. He regained his fathers
ReplyDeletehonor, and found the lost artifact so important to him, The Eagle.
Honor is the theme I am going to talk about
ReplyDelete"“Reuben, you are my firstborn, my might, the first sign of my strength, excelling in honor, excelling in power."
Genesis 49:3 NIV
Reuben is aa first born son, the main honor of a family.
Marcus is his families first (and only) born. Marcus is honorable. He is strong and powerful.
I think scripture agrees that we should show honor and be an honorable person.
Marcus shows his honor when he frees Esca and retrieves the eagle.
Esca shows his hinir when he helps marcus even when he gets freed.
I agree with Ben that many people say quotes like that, but many people misuse it and say you must fix anything you mess up at.
ReplyDeleteMARCUS DOES NEVER GIVE UP. He is a good example of fixing something no matter how hard it is.
I think one of the big themes of this movie was to stick with what you believe in. Marcus got ridiculed and criticized for what he believed in, the eagle. Im not saying that i agree with worshiping an eagle but if thats what he believes, then okay. Everyone has their own opinions and I think that we should respect that.
ReplyDeletei totally agree with what you are saying nathan about good vs. evil. i also think that the movie not only made the painted people look bad in the sense that they stole the egle, but that they made them physically look scary. they also made them seem really bad because of how the men that fought with Marcus' dad described them then and said what they did to his men.i found a verse that relates to good and evil, and it says "Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter." (Isaiah 5:20-21)i believe he is saying we shouldn't say that we are doing the right thing when we actually know we are sinning. it is related to the theme of whose good and whose evil because he is defining who is good and evil and that we need to be careful not to mix up the good and bad...and it gives a clearer idea of in the movie who is the good guy(s).p.s the post that says anonymous is me, it didn't work when i put my name.
ReplyDeleteThe Lord commands us not to have an idols like it says here. "You shall not make for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the fathers to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, but showing love to a thousand [generations] of those who love me and keep my commandments."
ReplyDeleteGod doesn't want us to worship idols, he wants us to worship him. In the movie they worshipped this metal eagle. It can't deliver them from their enemies like God can.
Maddie, I don't think that they were worshiping the eagle, at least not like a god. Throughout the movie Marcus would be praying to some god and putting incense in the fire. I don't think that the eagle was a god. I Googled it, and it really was in Ancient Rome. It was called the Aquila, and it was a statue that every legion carried with it to battle. It wasn't made of gold like the movie portrayed, it was probably made of something like silver and bronze. (Wikipedia) It don't think that they were worshiping it, I just think that it really mattered to them. It represented their hard work and legion. It is a lot like our American Flag, it represents our country.
ReplyDeleteAs to what Mr. Scott said a couple of posts ago, I think that could be true. During the whole movie Esca was trying to make Marcus think differently about his sacred Rome. We definitely need to see things differently as well. Like for me, I really like sports, but I have to realize the sports are not the only thing in this world. I think that could be a smaller theme, as other things stuck out to me more like friendship, loyalty, and honor.
McKenna, in the movie your right about how the Romans have no idols. I think what Maddie was trying to get at was that the tribal english people were worshiping the eagle in a very wrong way. One of the things I noticed though in the movie is that you had to kill people to get what you want. The Romans went into battle so they could keep their fort and their honor. Marcus killed to get his precious eagle back. One of the only good morals that came out this movie is keeping promises.
ReplyDeleteYes, I also noticed that you had to kill to get what you want. To get the eagle, Marcus had to kill the tribal people. Esca mislead them to believe that he was a friend. In life that, happens to, people pretend to be your friends, and yet they are not. They put a protective layer over themselves so you can not see their true personality. It is like wearing a mask for Halloween, you try to be someone else and nobody really knows who you are. The best relationships are when the mask is pulled away and you are honest with each other.
ReplyDeleteTo Mason
ReplyDeleteI think that is a great example about friendship. Esca hurted and humilated Marcus but he was still a friend to him. Zechariah 13:6 says; "If someone asks him, 'What are these wounds on your body?' he will answer 'The wounds I was given at the house of my friends."
Marcus was hurted by Esca and distrusted him because of what he did, but Esca was still his friend.
I agree with you Mason when you said that Esca had to cover up his true feelings about the tribe people to get what he wanted. Even though that showed that he was lying he was also protecting himself and Marcus from getting hurt which is what a true friend would do. Through all of the ups and downs in this movie I would still have to say that Friendship is the most important theme in this movie because Esca never left Marcus's side that that showed honor and trust which is what real friends have with one enother.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you guys. A loyal person would put themselves in danger like that. That was a noble move to actually brake Marcus out. He could have lived with that tribe for as long as he wanted but he chose to help his master. That takes honor.
ReplyDeleteI think that perseverance is another huge them in this movie. Romans 5:3 says "Not only so, but we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance." I think that this verse has some meaning relating to what I am saying. Such as, when you fight and suffer for what you set your mind to, you are persevering in the process of it.
ReplyDeleteI think that another theme of the movie was being able to trust people even when you feel doubtful. Several times Marcus had to trust others. Marcus had to trust Esca for several things. Marcus' uncle said that Esca would kill Marcus as soon as they were alone, but Marcus believed he didn't and took Esca with him anyways. After all of the tribe people had fallen asleep, Esca came to Marcus and told him that this was the only time he could get the eagle. Marcus had to trust Esca that he was really on his side, because earlier Esca told the tribe people that Marcus was a slave. Another theme is that you should trust yourself and your instincts. Marcus thought he heard something right outside of the walls, and he ordered that everyone be ready. However, no one could hear or see anything. Marcus had to trust his instincts and have everyone be ready anyways. Eventually, an attack was place on them, but Marcus and his men were ready. I think that the Bible disagrees with the idea of trusting others, and trusting yourself. The Bible says that you should put your trust in God. Proverbs 3:5 says, "Trust in the LORD with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding..." You should put your trust in God because he will never forsake you.
ReplyDelete